I think it was John Wesley or Charles Wesley of the Methodist Church who said that what the present generation tolerates, the next generation will embrace. My generation of senior ministers tolerated some things. The younger ones have taken it as a lifestyle and are making nonsense out of it.

We have to blame the generations that led us to this very situation. How did we get here? From 1966, the education culture, the way it was, to this level, what are the defining moments? There is one man of God who named his church the Remnant Church. Before someone can name a church ‘Remnant Church’, it means there is a serious problem.

I am not happy with my generation of ministers and the present generation, which has got worse. Today, it’s like anything goes. Magic is ministry. ‘Come and get your miracle’ is their message. ‘Come and get your miracle’ cannot make anybody grow into the image of Christ.

What role has your spouse played in your journey, and what sacrifice did she make that people don’t see?

Here’s a woman who schooled abroad, has a Postgraduate Diploma in Computer Science and worked with Nigeria’s fourth largest bank in those days. Here’s a woman who headed the bank’s training school in four or five states and was picked by her bank when the late Mrs Babangida was the First Lady and organised a conference for women in banking.

Here’s a woman who rose high in the bank, and after 14 years in the banking industry, she said God asked her to resign and join her husband in ministry. Yet, in the 15th year, she was entitled to a juicy package from her organisation when leaving. She forfeited it, and then in her 14th year at the bank, she left.

That’s a woman; indeed, a woman who, when I was both a branch pastor and in business, encouraged me tremendously. She stood with me, never to give bribes for anything. We lost a job because of that. We were to buy a house in GRA with the profit. We had gone ahead to price the building, but we were asked to give kickback before they would give us the work, but I refuse

When I told her, she said, ‘Darling, don’t worry, this is not how God wants to make us rich. It’s good that you refused to offer a bribe.’ I was very young then. This woman never pushed me away on days when things were not going well with me, days when three people would share one egg in my house, even though the price of an egg was relatively cheap.

She has never made me feel sorry for being a man. Such women are very rare. Mind you, she came from a richer family in a better social background. For the first time in her life, I made her climb on a motorbike when I was in my early 30s or 31 or so.

In those days, her parents were big, yet she came to my level to start life. Many men wanted to marry her, but she said it was God who asked her to marry. A woman like that is rare. She was 68 last month. She pleaded that her birthday shouldn’t be celebrated owing to the financial commitment to programmes here and there. Such women are rare, and I salute her.

Some people are complaining that we have more churches than industries, which should boost employment in the country. What’s your view about it?

It is the work of the government to create an enabling environment for industries to thrive. That is the work of every government. When you look at my library, I have books about Singapore, how it developed, and Dubai, how it developed. These are among my best books. There has to be an environment created by the governing authority for this to happen.

It used to be different in those days. We had companies like Kaduna Textile Mills that sponsored top-tier football clubs. Asaba Textile Mills did the same. In those days, teams like Leventis Football Club and a few others were sponsored by companies. That was how vibrant the industrial and sports scenes were.

Today, look at the environment. The Ankara fabric you’re wearing, even the one I used to make my dress, was imported from China. Yet, the Chinese don’t wear Ankara. So effectively, we’re creating jobs and sustaining industries in China, not Nigeria.

The issue isn’t that churches are taking over factories; it’s that governments over the years failed to protect and grow these industries. The decline began a long time ago, particularly during the military era, and since then, it’s been a free fall. What is the role of government? To me, building roads and bridges or commissioning water projects are routine responsibilities of the government. They’re not achievements; they’re basic duties.

The government is meant to enhance the quality of life of its people. God is the originator of government; He instituted the government of Heaven before the creation of the earth. So, governance has a divine origin and purpose.

When God created the earth, sun, moon, stars—He had one central purpose: the creation of man. Therefore, man is the reason for creation. And by extension, the government exists to serve man.

So, if you build airports everywhere but the average Nigerian’s quality of life remains low, you’ve missed the point of governance. That’s why many Nigerians have nowhere to turn but to take refuge in God. Unfortunately, much of this is not even grounded in genuine faith; it’s desperation. People flock to churches seeking solace.

How can the church address this issue?

While the government must do its part, the church shouldn’t fold its arms either. Some churches are stepping up, creating employment not just by hiring pastors but by establishing schools and industries. In our case, we’re focusing on education and, most importantly, agriculture. That’s why we’re setting up the University of Agriculture and Rural Development.

According to Dr Akinwumi Adesina, President of the African Development Bank, 67 per cent of the world’s arable land is in Africa, and most of that is in Nigeria. I’ve always been aware of this fact, but I didn’t know the exact figure until I heard it from him. If most of the world’s fertile land is in Nigeria, then many Nigerians are naturally supposed to be farmers.

That means there’s an innate agricultural potential in us. If we can harness and develop that potential, Nigeria can feed the world. That is why people like us identify and train those who are interested and have the capacity. We’re enrolling them in our University of Agriculture and Rural Development. Some are members of our church; others are from different places.

After interviews, we hire and train them. Today, they’re earning better than they were before. While the government should lead in driving development, the private sector must also be encouraged to invest in industries. Though it’s not primarily the role of the church, the church should play a part.

In addition to establishing the University of Agricultural and Rural Development, you also have a vision to establish an interest-free microfinance bank. How do you intend to go about it?

Right now, we have what is known as the Bank of Hope. This is not a registered bank yet. We see people who have potential and who can do something. We started with some N20m, though paying back was a challenge. From there, we helped them to stand financially on their feet, and it is interest-free.

As God blesses our ministry more and more, we hope to make it become like a microfinance bank that will operate at that level, interest-free. We’re going to get that one to help people stand on their feet. The African Children Village, which we are putting up for children who are abandoned, is ongoing. There are other projects, which we’re going to inaugurate later this year.

Before the end of this year, we’re going to lay the foundation stone for the university, the children’s village, and the New Life for Teenage Mothers Centre; we have already acquired the building in Lagos. It is for them to have a second chance at life.